FAR AIM | Aviation Reg's | Aeronautical Info | FARAIM
A Drinking Podcast; That Sometimes Talks About Airplanes And Learning To Fly. A Private Pilot, A Commercial Pilot And An Airline Transport Pilot (ATP) As Hosts. They Got Board With The FAR AIM Book Years Ago But Are To Lazy To Change The Podcast Name (or do any show prep whatsoever for that matter). Welcome To The Oddest, Most Irreverent And Controversial Pilot Podcast In America.
FAR AIM | Aviation Reg's | Aeronautical Info | FARAIM
#134 | Mastering Cockpit Automation and Overcoming Flight Deck Challenges in Modern Aviation | Guest: Barbara Sutton | Part 2 of 2
Ready to demystify cockpit automation and overcome the challenges of flight deck digitization? Join us for an insightful conversation with our special guest, Barbara Sutton, as we explore the complexities of modern aviation. We discuss everything from human factors that affect pilots' performance to the importance of communication and mastering automation.
In this episode, we dive into the significance of descent planning and situational awareness while managing crossing restrictions. Barbara shares her wealth of knowledge on how pilots can make critical decisions under pressure, and how effective communication between pilots can ensure a smooth and secure flight. We also delve into the world of single-pilot operations, tackling the stigma and uncovering the secrets of their success in navigating complex airspace.
As we uncover the nuances of cockpit automation, Barbara emphasizes the importance of being able to fly an aircraft manually, and how an obsession with the newest technology can hinder pilots who haven't mastered these essential skills. We also discuss the differences between general aviation and transport category airplanes, as well as the costs of retrofitting fleets. So, buckle up and join us on this fascinating journey into the world of modern aviation, and learn how to stay in control, even when the skies get turbulent.
Episode edit, title, description, transcript and chapter markers brought to you by AI...
Follow The Show On X: https://x.com/faraimpodcast
Subscribe And Watch Full Episodes On The Rumble: https://rumble.com/FARAIM
Subscribe And Watch Highlight Clips On The YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/FARAIMPodcast
Welcome to part two this week of the Faray podcast. If you joined us two weeks ago, you remember Barbara Suttonon. We are talking, sometimes we stay on aviation, sometimes we even stay on the topic we're covering, which is cockpit automation, flight deck digitization. Did I say that right? It's a hard word to say Digitization. Okay, Where do we leave off? Were we done taxing? even the last episode?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't even know if we made it in the air.
Speaker 3:We definitely didn't make it into the air. We didn't talk about takeoff.
Speaker 4:Let's fast forward, barb, let's fast forward.
Speaker 3:All right Okay.
Speaker 4:Our next phase Takeoff. We got to take this thing off.
Speaker 1:We're still on the ground.
Speaker 2:Yeah Hour in.
Speaker 3:I'm in. Listen, a lot of the things I said I last two weeks ago still apply. If you're taking off, or if you're climbing, or if you're in cruise, right, If you're monitoring those screens and you're continuously monitoring those screens, the human factors are going to kick in. You're going to have an issue with your eyes, an issue with fatigue, an issue with memory or whatever. Like any phase of flight that you're in, whether it's the first leg or the second leg of a trip or a day or whatever it is, those things are going to greatly affect your ability to function properly in the cockpit.
Speaker 4:For sure In there. I think maybe some people may forget I'm sure you don't because you're into it, but we have checklists we have to run all the time.
Speaker 4:So, like when we're taxing, we have a tax checklist before takeoff. While we're technically still taxing, we have a before takeoff checklist that we are running every item and they don't take a lot of time. And we've gone to great lengths myself in the fleet, lead the check airmen in the fleet to pair that down and to boil that down because these errors do creep in. The time it takes for anybody to be heads down allows more errors and other external factors to play a part in losing situational awareness or whatever the case may be. And the same once we're in flight, so like we've taken off now out of so kind of like our call out 400 feet, the pilot monitoring would say 400 feet, the pilot flying would say okay, flaps up, y'all, damper on after takeoff checklist. And so then I have a flow as pilot monitoring to do and I have all these items.
Speaker 4:And then, of course, atc. There's towers, switching over to departure. You're getting communication established with departure and doing what they say, which is often something which allows you because the other guys hand flying. So now you're, you're doing the automation stuff for not automation per se, but you are manipulating the flight guidance panel for them, for them to follow because it controls the command bars on the primary flight display. So, with their hand flying, all they're on is thrust lovers, yoke and rudder pedals. That's it. They're not touching anything else.
Speaker 4:So you as pilot flight or pilot monitoring would be manipulating and basically inputting the controls ATC gave you for them to follow is the bottom line. But in there I haven't even ran the checklist. I did my flow, i talked to ATC and at some point I got to get my checklist done. I never followed up with the checklist And so you know Barb's talking about, you know how these arrows can creep in and how digitization automation plays a part. And, like we're not, we haven't even talked about the time, the time it takes, which artificially compresses the timeline to get things done.
Speaker 4:Which obviously weighs on you as a person 100%.
Speaker 3:So this is another phenomenon or phenomena, i don't know. I don't even know if it's that, but its cognitive overload is what it's called And it's generally regarded to define it as like mental processing demands that are placed on a person during the performance of a task. So, like you said, you're hand flying, you're doing certain things, you have another pilot, let's say, monitoring the automation or whatever it is, and that the workload as it gets. and you didn't even run a checklist right. So the workload refers to all the tasks that you have to do. And then this overload happens when you know you have more than you're physically or mentally capable of doing, which oftentimes will happen in a GA aircraft because you're not always flying with, you know, a first officer or a captain or whatever, right, you might be flying alone. And then you have all of these other elements that you need to run right.
Speaker 4:And I don't know how they do it. I think about it in like. We tend to have this, like this stigma against a single pilot citation or a TBM or a Malibu, whatever it is, ciris in a highly complex class Bravo airspace. It's busy, you're an IMC and you have all of the automation and technology that we have in a transport category airplane, but you're a single pilot now, correct? It's like how do they do it Like I don't need to know?
Speaker 1:There was some insurance video I had to watch the Kings had it on their FIRC program of a guy flying back from the business owner flying back in his phenom from the Caribbean landed in Miami like during a storm. It's obviously trying to like teach you stuff about like decision-making process And it was terrifying.
Speaker 2:Like what's a phenom again?
Speaker 1:The Bombardier Embraer. Embraer, it's just a small sweet personal.
Speaker 2:Like a single pilot jet.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, they're single pilot, but then you can get.
Speaker 1:Like it just walked through the loads that guy had on him And this is obviously acting. I don't know if it was based off a true story or not And like you're just like, oh, that's logical, how he's like being overwhelmed right now.
Speaker 1:And like air traffic control is telling him something. He's hitting a couple of buttons on the thing. It's not doing it, so that's taking his attention, but he's still going. However many knots into Miami. Like, while he's trying to figure this out, everything is still going forward. It doesn't matter that that task is tripping him up for like a little bit longer than it should have. And now he's just behind and gets a little frazzled And it's like that's how statistics happen.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's piling up.
Speaker 4:It's like playing this game of Tetris And like you're trying to that last, that last that row you have a perfect row of bricks at the bottom And you're towards the higher, higher levels, right, and it's really speeding up, and you're trying to figure out how to get that one in there and you're tapping a couple of times to get it to fit right in that slot But you already have three other pieces on the board coming down. That's exactly the way it feels When we see this slot and I know we're kind of going out of chronological order now, but that's when we feel. A lot is when they give you a crossing restriction on descent People. Decent planning is what I see more commonly Then not as the issue.
Speaker 4:They don't know how to decent plan. They don't know how to do math, quick math. And if the FMS, the flight management system, is not Pre-programmed for this crossing restriction which a lot of times, we can see it coming because, again, situation awareness You listen to the person in front of you. You probably been following them for 300 miles.
Speaker 4:So I listen to the person in front of you, see what cross restriction they get constantly going into. You know South Florida, we get, you know we get on in pin cross, in pin two, nine or zero. Well, the chart says three, one, zero. If you have that in there, obviously that's two thousand feet difference. It depends on when they give you. But I could be a very big difference in The, the vertical speed required to cross it. And if you can't program that quickly or do the quick mental math, okay, i'm at 31. I need to get to 21 and I have five miles to do it, which I can't do that math right now anyways either. But that's That's well. You'd need a lot more than that. That'd be crazy. Yeah, you can't. If you can't do the mental math to make that cross restriction work, that takes you completely out of out of out of the role. You're completely saturated. Task. Saturated is the term that I use. Right, that's exactly what it's called. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, a hundred percent. And now compound that with, let's say, you know, an emergency Right where you have extra stress and you're trying to get down really quickly, or something like that right. Humans don't have the capacity to complete all of these things, especially when they're under pressure. You know the the the human factor side, like biologically, psychologically or whatever. You, you react to things by processing what's going on. So in your example, where, let's say, you're setting the FMS right, you're understanding that, okay, here's what I'm seeing in the planes in front of me.
Speaker 3:And then you have to make a decision Well, am I gonna program it now, am I gonna wait? and then you have to process the response of that decision. So, am I, am I doing this, am I not doing this? or let's say you, you, you get something to program and you're going Okay, now what do I have to do? and then you have to actually act out on it. So in that space of time, yeah, it can happen instantaneously, let's say within a human brain, but if there are other things going on at the time, that process is going to be interrupted. Your situational awareness is going to be Interrupted, you're not going to know where you are. And, like I said, compound it with an emergency in your toast.
Speaker 4:Yeah, i guess even simpler than that. Then, just you Working with yourself in a single pilot, yeah, am I gonna program this now? Am I gonna wait? and maybe they'll give me what the chart says? in a two pilot crew, you're always hey, man, you mind if I put this in now. So it's not even. You're not even have a talk with yourself anymore. You haven't done another person you may have already had the talk what takes, which maybe takes you a little bit out of the equation, but then you're gonna present the same question to another person. It's gonna take them out of the equation for a minute.
Speaker 4:So who's watching the airplane at this point in time while you're having this conversation, where you're both a Dedicating hard drive or a ram to you know, to this, to this one Stupid at the point at that point in time article. Now, it allows you to be ahead. Here's the, here's the justification You have in that conversation. Now Put you both more back in the saddle later on down the road when it is arguably There's more happening. So there is that. There's a win, there's a little bit of a win there to have it, but it's better to do it early than late. Yes, but you still have to do it. So if you do it early still both takes you out. You kind of do lose a little bit. You know you're both not flying the airplane But it cruise, eh, i mean it.
Speaker 4:You get desensitized to it. Like I'm amping up some stuff a little bit right now, but you do get desensitized. All of this I and one of my best analogies is If you're used to driving your Buick all the time, 35 miles an hour feels fast. If you're riding a crotch rocket every day, 140 miles an hour feels fast. That that is, that, is this. That is the thing. Like you get desensitized to some of the stimuli You can. You just buy a, the repetition and and the conditioning you get. You get more in tune with how quickly information comes at you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, i think also what you. You said something very important about effective Communication, right. If you have that conversation in your head and you bring it out to someone else And now you guys are effectively communicating, ideally you're not spending an exorbitant amount of time discussing it, right? because then who's flying the airplane, right? There's that accident. I can't remember what airline it was, but they had a, a landing light that was out like a heard the story.
Speaker 3:Eastern, yeah something. And You know when, when the, when the gear goes down, the light turns green, when it's down and locked. And It turns out it was down and locked But the little light, the indicator light in the cockpit was not working And they didn't know whether or not it was down and locked. And so, like It was back in the time where there were flight engineers and all three people in the cockpit were focused on this one light, you go down and you check and you look at it and and I think they ended up it was they either ran out of gas Or it was a see fit, like they fully Crashed, and it was because they just spent time focusing on a light that literally was just a light. They were actually down and locked. And so it just goes to show you that the effective communication And and making sure that there is somebody always, you know, manning The actual flying of the plane is so important.
Speaker 4:Yeah, managing the aircraft state for sure, yeah, absolutely. I mean, i see these errors creep in. I'm trying to. You know We have a limited scope in in the airplanes. I've flown the airplanes I fly in the geographical region, so there's some errors, of course, that don't, or threats that don't come in. You know We're not flying that much in the mountains. You know we're not going out of Mexico and flying in big mountains with the language barrier. Those things they just compound. And then you don't have a VNav, you don't have it set up correctly, and they give you a clearance, and then you're, you're always racing, and then all of these items You have to do it in the same period of time Just because now you have more jobs to do and it's just, it's just crazy how they compound like that. But, um, yeah, what I see the biggest one is is that you know the nav, the vertical, the vertical, descent planning Or just descent planning. It is what gets a lot of people.
Speaker 4:It takes so much of their Mental energy the mental energy, yeah, whatever, yeah to make that happen. And it's like, dude, you weren't thinking about this 30 miles ago, you weren't thinking about this a hundred miles ago. It's simple equation. And Now you need to know what altitude you're kind of looking at. You know, and, and obviously the charts normally give you some guidance as To what an ideal altitude would be, but it just it still takes time for a new guy to start figuring these things out when you're used to flying around all the time At 3,000 feet, when you're at 30,000 feet, it's a big difference. So yeah.
Speaker 4:I see those things creep in but I mean I Guess. Okay, I guess you notice I kind of jump to Descent stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's fair, i mean, for the amount of time we spent taxing. I feel like we're at 30,000 feet very quickly, but that means fine.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it seems to me training seems to be a bit king. The way. The way I see automation is, it's supposed to be help, not a hindrance, and so something that that I commonly in. I was trying to I get. I tried to make this point earlier. I know it didn't land, but If you can fly the automation, you can fly the plane. That is when I get these new guys and they want to hand fly. They've been talking about flying, they just want to new line, new people Lee new people. Yeah, i'm sorry.
Speaker 2:No, yeah, new flying right person, get that score up. Baby flying new flying Yeah, flying people flying persons people Persons yeah, flying persons Yeah, okay.
Speaker 4:I think what when? when they them get, when they them.
Speaker 2:Well, okay, yeah.
Speaker 4:They want to, you know, fly. They want to be hands-on The airplane. They don't want the autopilot flying it, they want to be flying it. They there's in, there's a multiple, because I've been there, you know, and most people graduating into these airplanes have this Probably similar thought process. They want to prove they can do it, that they're not an idiot. They have as an fo you have limited in instances to prove that you don't suck at everything.
Speaker 4:And so you know you're not getting a lot of, you're not able to put in a lot of input on The release, fuel planning, this, that, the other thing. So when it is your turn to fly, it's your turn to fly right. So you want, you want to do it and show you can, i can be right on 250 knots. You, i can do a nice smooth level off all these things. You, you want to display all of those things. But what you don't, what you end up not doing, is you end up not mastering automation. And when you master automation And it can be done if it's done right by hand flying you got to be a little bit further ahead. But if you can master automation, just get that autopilot on and Then you are the one pressing the buttons up there instead of the next person. You have to see, you need to interpret, and then you need to do.
Speaker 2:Yep.
Speaker 4:And, and you know it's maybe a two, three step versus a two step or you know whatever. But I think it gets you much more tuned. If I will maintain, if you can fly the automation, you can fly the airplane. And it seems like Some of your research has indicated I Know I'm pulling it way down It has it indicated, made the point, it's intentional, it a 1000% is. It goes from G1000 for your GA. If, if you were to call that kind of the benchmark right, just something in the G series with a bunch of soft keys and all kinds of stuff, bunch of menus on your PFT, you go from that. When you go to transport category, it gets easier, it gets simpler. You don't have a bunch of soft keys. You may not have any buttons. You can press on that PFD bezel at all or MFD bezel at all. So you go from like the GA guy and all one trip through sporty's catalog tells you how obsessed people are with tech.
Speaker 1:No, yeah.
Speaker 4:We just want goofy shit in in something that I think might make my life easier. More thing put my flight bag to justify The leather flight bag I have.
Speaker 1:I don't really know 16 kneeboards later that you don't use. That's right.
Speaker 4:You got to find the right one, though, man.
Speaker 2:There is no right. Every salvage plane I buy has a kneeboard in it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, they do. Private pilots, GA guys are obsessed with tech and I don't know if has something to do with the type a personality Where they want to do this one thing better.
Speaker 2:They want to copy no, I don't want to do anything. We just want for us.
Speaker 4:They want the external look to be like I'm a per, i'm a professional. They want when they come into this big airport they have it looks all buttoned up, no matter how chaotic or what work They load they had to put into it to make it look that way. They want to be seamless from the outside.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:I got the iPhone 8, so I'm up to date on the phone, okay but the the when you go to, and there's also the cost of retrofitting to. Obviously you go get an airliner. It's not nearly as cheap to a reoutfit the whole fleet with the newest, if it's even legal to do. Look at the b52s though.
Speaker 2:My god, how long are they gonna keep those things flying?
Speaker 4:I don't know what they did do on, but did they just re-retrofit?
Speaker 2:They put new engines on them and they plan on flying them through. Whatever year they're flying them, plan on flying them through, we'll put them over a hundred years of service.
Speaker 4:Bring back those b17s right.
Speaker 2:We got a few hundred years, 20 more years, that'd be like, yeah, that would be That they will be Older than bringing back the b17s right now when we retire them.
Speaker 4:Fantastic yeah, yeah the Australians and the British wouldn't do that. No, no, Anyways.
Speaker 2:So I triple seven is pretty good, though I'm I was kind of pissed about them Getting rid of the 747, but the triple seven's not. it's a pretty good replacement. It's more efficient, it's not quite as big, but It's a nice. but it's a nice plane.
Speaker 4:I don't know if I remember one on one.
Speaker 2:Well, they've had them for a while but like the triple seven, nine is like what they're using to replace the okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah so I mean it's left.
Speaker 4:So I think about like the how Um.
Speaker 2:Whatever, wow, wow, lee, just derailed, i just know, it's southern over here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, using my, my thesis lingo, i just, i, just I feel like that's a, a hypothesis, that If you knew the equipment inside and out, it'd be less distracting, but you don't get trained typically in like worst-case scenario, which is where the accidents happen.
Speaker 4:We you know, in barbecue, to test this, the there's a chain of Errors that compound or a chain of events. There's no one single events that brings down a plane.
Speaker 1:I understand that. I'm saying given any chain of events, you take a pilot you'll be better.
Speaker 4:Who knows that?
Speaker 1:thing left and right you'll be, better. There's a pilot who knows it. 40 to 60 percent.
Speaker 4:You'll be better the, the.
Speaker 1:The distraction of that device is not going to be as high with the person who knows it inside.
Speaker 4:So are you advocating Barb jump in anytime, but are you advocating more training, or more training on the operation of systems?
Speaker 1:more Training and understanding of the systems and particularly how all those menus work, what every button does, what every phase.
Speaker 4:We don't have the buttons. Like I just said a little bit ago the well, you said buttons. Okay, don't ask me buttons.
Speaker 1:You said I know what you mean no buttons.
Speaker 4:How do you buttons you're describing? you said buttons.
Speaker 1:Okay, what does every?
Speaker 3:button I.
Speaker 4:Don't know, you tell me, and then I will answer you.
Speaker 1:I want someone to be able to navigate through. There's nothing that device like, not from the software FMS you talking PFT, mft?
Speaker 4:What are you talking about? either one, okay, two totally different things. I'm talking buttons on an MFT.
Speaker 1:You know how to do everything that machine is doing.
Speaker 4:I don't know how to do anything.
Speaker 1:Any of the airplanes I've flown no, no, i mean like there's no screen, that you don't know how to get to real quick, and just you know I need that.
Speaker 4:I need to know what that, all that information it may tell me means, and you're you're acting. Nothing Catastrophic is probably gonna happen in the FMS.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 4:So that's where most of the buttons are in most a lot of stuff.
Speaker 3:Okay, so the other, the other beneficial to know About the systems and to understand how to navigate different screens and buttons or no buttons or whatever I mean. Obviously that's gonna be more helpful. I Don't think that's what we were arguing, right?
Speaker 1:I'm arguing Know your computer on it so well that you're never fiddling with it, trying to get it like It's never a problem to go do something with it, just like a steam game, a problem if you Yeah, just like a steam gauge, no problem.
Speaker 3:You listen to the a new. You're a new pilot and you're listening to the aides or the a wasp or whatever, and you're. You need to Now adjust your altimeter, that's that. Your brain is off of flying because you're with that little colesman window.
Speaker 1:I mean no matter what you're going to have to step out to To pay attention to that and I think turning that knob is different than figuring out which buttons you press on a G 1000 to get it's not go to that highlighter and then move it.
Speaker 3:I don't think it is. I think it's the same thing. I think, regardless, it takes a second of your time to be like what do I have to do, what do I have to look at? And then you're taking that second out and that second you could look back up and all of a sudden you're on taxiway whatever instead of taxiway whatever.
Speaker 1:I just haven't been in a G1000, so I know how to turn the knob.
Speaker 4:I can't remember how to do it in the G1000. So we should, we need to mitigate those issues and not be doing that on the taxi.
Speaker 3:That is what the PC version of me would say Or when you're land whatever.
Speaker 4:It should all be done prior to top of decent, just like with our briefing. That should already be set. We should already know what it's going to be. so we're not doing that. That is not. I mean, i'm sure the statistics probably bear out like oh yeah, that's when the issues happen, that's when accidents happen, that's when they lose their social awareness But and of course emergency did not happen right then. And so obviously statistics bear out things differently than what I have perceived them to be in actual practice. But I'm a small sample size.
Speaker 4:The number of keystrokes, i think, do matter on the G1000. Or I don't know what the example is exactly Like. if it's altimeter setting, i don't know what that takes in a G1000. I would assume it's simple, but I don't know that. Obviously on a coltman window on an altimeter normal it's quick. everybody gets that. I'm assuming that's a largely intuitive on any of the advanced flight systems. I don't know. But when you get to more complex things, how many times do you in muscle memory click the wrong key and you have to backspace? How many times do you click the wrong thing Because you're predicting, That's your problem.
Speaker 2:you're typing.
Speaker 3:That's a very good point You're predicting You make typos all the time.
Speaker 4:Everybody does, everybody does On your phone.
Speaker 2:That's fine.
Speaker 4:No.
Speaker 2:You're still typing using a computer.
Speaker 4:You're living in the dark ages, you're going through motion so quickly.
Speaker 3:ATC will just send you text messages.
Speaker 4:these days They will, yeah, they'll send you text messages. Now Nobody types.
Speaker 2:Yes, they do, even on your phone. You talk into it and type, you talk to try to write On the FMS.
Speaker 4:On the.
Speaker 2:FMS, I don't type anything. I talk into my computer and it types it all for me. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm gonna try to write a program for school, Yeah.
Speaker 2:TPT, i guarantee you could Right.
Speaker 1:If you use Dragon and use Reverse curly bracket, space enter.
Speaker 2:No, it knows all the symbols. You could just learn to say them and it would do it.
Speaker 1:Whatever you wanted to do, i guarantee I can type fast and you can talk.
Speaker 2:No, you can't.
Speaker 1:You talk very slow.
Speaker 2:I talk fast. I can talk very fast. I talk fast. He's got one, if I know what I want to say.
Speaker 1:He's got it, i edit you for hours every week, right.
Speaker 2:I know.
Speaker 1:I can type faster than you talk on the show at least.
Speaker 2:Okay, but if I'm entering in, that's a perfect example. If. I'm entering in Okay but if okay, I have a list of parts.
Speaker 1:I have four sentences ahead of you right now.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, it's very easy to type for him, just so you know. Yeah, i guarantee you can not type fast and I can talk. It's not possible. Nobody can talk. Nobody can type as fast as somebody can talk For everyone who listens to the show, even like the fastest typers in the world cannot type as fast as you can talk.
Speaker 3:Can I just I need. I noticed something Even when you were talking. you made a mistake and backtracked what you were saying. Nobody can talk, nobody can type as fast.
Speaker 2:Right, but I'm reading it off of paper. I'm reading it off of something. I'm just saying the words. I already have the parts, the prices and anything that's wrong with it written down, So I'm just reading it as I want it to be written.
Speaker 3:So you basically typed it already, and then you're rereading it.
Speaker 2:It's from the shop. Exactly the time goes for the shop to the office. Why don't you just take a photo of?
Speaker 1:it and have chat GPT do it for you.
Speaker 2:Because it's not quite there yet. There is no way that you could type enter in the information that I have to enter in using a mouse and keyboard as fast as I can do it verbally Not possible.
Speaker 3:Exactly, which is why, if you're flying and ATC texts too, it's a very big problem.
Speaker 2:Well, i'm just saying I would like it on a screen though, because then I could go back and read it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, but you need to address it pretty much And that's a perception of ours that it needs to be an instantaneous adjustment in your flight path. Atc says something oh, i need to do it right now. And then you go into predictive text mode on your FMS and you start key stroking And it's like oh, i was on a different screen than I thought I was, so that key does something different this time. You understand where you are spatially with inside that system, but it doesn't mean that it doesn't take you extra time to get back expert. So, even though you know it intuitively, you may take yourself three pages away from where you wanna be.
Speaker 2:This was the Oscars. Then they cut you off. Part two, barbara Sutton, we're wrapping it up.
Speaker 1:I like thank you again. Andrew says just leave ATC on red Yeah, perfect advice. Notifications don't even just let it build up, barbara.
Speaker 3:thank you again for coming on.
Speaker 1:We're gonna wrap up this series going to the after chat here, the handful people in the chat. If you have any questions, do it in. I feel like there's enough. Argument still going on. Dan Freight, I'm a big fan of you. Argument still going on.
Speaker 2:Dan Freight says I'm his favorite. Okay.
Speaker 3:I'm his favorite.
Speaker 2:No, he said I'm his favorite.
Speaker 4:Well, we're gonna see you in a second, i'm sure he'll respond to that, Dan settle it right now. Dan said I'm his favorite. You don't have a chance.
Speaker 1:As always, thanks for the barb You're doing you, tyler and Jared agreed to do the next episode, right?
Speaker 4:Yes, we did.
Speaker 2:On your own. That's out of the free list. That's out of the free list. Okay, yeah, so we're gonna have a full guest episode. Yeah, yeah, cause you guys don't have time.
Speaker 1:And Scott will listen to that one finally, you guys don't have time to do it. We have a lot of firsts, scott.
Speaker 4:Yes, we have the first female guest and Scott's first episode you ever listened to Coming right up.
Speaker 2:Wow, wait, i can listen to it.
Speaker 4:Well, it'll be interesting, cause it'll be not the three of us, it'll be three new people.
Speaker 2:I'm not at all that good.
Speaker 3:Exactly Pilot ground takeover is what I'm calling it.
Speaker 2:All right, dan said be soot So see.
Speaker 1:Soot Yep, soot It's me, it's me Okay, thanks for listening, take care, see you guys, see you later Later.